Young Hands
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Ossasepia



diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002592 - if I understand correctly what you're saying there, you are looking for an inner change *first and foremost*; which is correct and sensible but requires specific targetting to, just like any other work really
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 19:28:51 bvt: i can not currently express it in the words, but to at least try: due to the immutable past that i had i overtrained in one areas and skipped others; and as i see it, this would push me to a ~similar way of living everywhere - yes, food/money/people around may be different, but if life for me = X, succeeding at building X at the new place may be ~as bad as failing at life there at all. i.e. - i could move
diana_coman: ie if you say you aren't moving because it's not the outside but the inside that needs work, that's fine; but then start opening up and working on all of you, not just some areas
diana_coman: fwiw the overspecialisation (that's what your "overtrained in one area and skipped others" is) is not a healthy way to live just like a table with only 2 legs is not a very good table.
diana_coman: or not a very stable one in general, lolz
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002594 - uk is just the latest stop really
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 19:35:47 shrysr: diana_coman: may I ask why UK, and howddya choose Reading?
diana_coman: ahaha shrysr look what I found for you (while searching for a different post actually) - it'll probably resonate with your polite canadians and all that: http://ossasepia.com/2013/06/16/intellectually-fit-as-socially-misfit/
diana_coman: shrysr: found it, the post re moving countries and places: http://ossasepia.com/2011/03/25/plecarile-mele/ (it links to the one musing on the reasons for it too) but yes, they are both from a time I still wrote in Romanian mostly
diana_coman: to summarise though: I kept moving (and mentally even more than the physical would directly tell); looking back, at some point I realised that I pretty much traced where the meaning *used to be* until I finally accepted that it's not anymore in any of those places.
diana_coman: I stopped at the UK mainly because of a combination of the above + the child's need for stability until he is a bit older (he's almost 7).
diana_coman: and as TMSR is not bound to a physical place anyway, being here is fine for now.
diana_coman: as to Reading: it's small enough and close enough to the countryside (even "posh countryside" as I found only after some time here) to be pleasant while at the same time big/industrial enough to be very well connected (both rail and airways)
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002595 - well, practice makes perfect, sure; but what you *are* is one thing; what you *do* is another.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 19:54:36 shrysr: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-12#1002338 << does a master need to have, well, slaves or knights or etc to be master, or grow as a master? It does not appear mandatory as a qualification, when it is linked to being free, but what abt growth as a master? Being free/master != being perfect innit ?
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-12 16:48:00 diana_coman: re being a master though, I'd say it's one of those things - when/if you are one, you'll know; before that you can of course bang your head on "I want to be one" and shout loudly as to why it doesn't work, plenty do precisely that.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-12 17:06:09 diana_coman: shrysr: perhaps it's clearer put whether you can stand to be fully free or not; links back to the causes and purposes, remember?
diana_coman: a master without slaves is still a master - just one who focuses on other things than growing others; a slave without a master is still a slave - just one nobody can be bothered with but no freer for that
diana_coman: perfection doesn't enter into it; no living person is perfect, by definition
diana_coman: the slave/master is not a quantitative difference (ie it's not that the slave has x something while the master has 10x the same thing)
diana_coman: it's a qualitative difference, there is a gap; and for similar reasons it's not really slave/knight as they are not the same sort either if you talk of their natures
diana_coman: at any rate, the distinction is pretty much made by the person's *own* needs, not external through some labels or roles or whatever else
diana_coman: and acknowledging it is simply the most basic acts of looking in the mirror without pretense, nothing more (and as such a very useful thing to practice, hence the requirement to "say it")
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002518 - this here "say so" is not because I can't see it otherwise but because admitting to what one needs is a basic requirement to improvement.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 09:08:16 diana_coman: have a look around, ask any questions you need to ask and if/when you decide you want to submit to training here, say so.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002605 - precisely this, quite well said actually.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 20:48:31 shrysr: thought - if found+fired - then so be it. if allowed - i might even venture to say - there is no point being here...and not .. well being honest / vulnerable - in order to become stronger, as I think you advised before.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002610 - hey, he's been even *practicing* for it (http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-11#1002089) and still no dice!!
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 20:52:59 asciilifeform: lobbes: since day1 ('07) in fact
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-11 17:24:17 asciilifeform: it dun bother me so much, i think of it as practice run for when in gestapo chair.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002624 - at which point I realise that this is possibly dangerous for young minds so let's restate: your nature is what it is, no matter what you decide to do (including negating it, as it's quite often the case); however, in practical terms, you are defined by your actions, yes.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 05:54:25 diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002595 - well, practice makes perfect, sure; but what you *are* is one thing; what you *do* is another.
shrysr: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-09#1001733 << forgot to mention i checked this out few days ago - will need visa as it is based on nationality and not PR. believe added complication is that the visa involves a biometric process, and so will have to show up to consulate to get done. I think it wd be sensible to plan for this in the first half of 2020, and think it is important to do.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-09 13:43:29 diana_coman: shrysr: so come and visit Reading, have a talk face to face at least, then.
shrysr: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002619 << well fwiw i think the article describes something that is quite the norm in india, i.e the 'politically correct' expression, esp in business. i think canadians are polite in the sense - wd apologise profusely but still bother significantly less abt saying something inapppropriate. I wdnt say i've gotta great feel for them being mostly glued to
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 05:24:53 diana_coman: ahaha shrysr look what I found for you (while searching for a different post actually) - it'll probably resonate with your polite canadians and all that: http://ossasepia.com/2013/06/16/intellectually-fit-as-socially-misfit/
shrysr: computer, and not having read the news in a long time.
shrysr: The most remarkable example of change in nature b/w US and Can - I experienced on a greyhound bus ride from toronto to NYC.... they switch drivers at the border. ALmost feels like the air changes at that point. There is a 'world' of difference between immigration officials of these countries for sure! Sit on the bus in toronto - they explain wazzaaa and the 'travel plan' etc... even help you plonk in big
shrysr: bags. Exact opposite when you get on in NY. Not a Single word is spoken. lol, don't even get answers to questions asked.. disharmony and ... some sort of 'oppression'/arrogance (for lack of better word) in the air.
diana_coman: lol, that sounds very... communist/soviet of them.
diana_coman: aka of the US you describe.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002643 - sounds ok.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 10:13:48 shrysr: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-09#1001733 << forgot to mention i checked this out few days ago - will need visa as it is based on nationality and not PR. believe added complication is that the visa involves a biometric process, and so will have to show up to consulate to get done. I think it wd be sensible to plan for this in the first half of 2020, and think it is important to do.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002645 - hm, my (admiteddly, limited) interactions with people from that area in a more formal setting tends to paint a different picture: the focus is not at all on politically correct but on lip-service to authority (and possibly savage beating of the underlings)
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 10:50:17 shrysr: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002619 << well fwiw i think the article describes something that is quite the norm in india, i.e the 'politically correct' expression, esp in business. i think canadians are polite in the sense - wd apologise profusely but still bother significantly less abt saying something inapppropriate. I wdnt say i've gotta great feel for them being mostly glued to
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 05:24:53 diana_coman: ahaha shrysr look what I found for you (while searching for a different post actually) - it'll probably resonate with your polite canadians and all that: http://ossasepia.com/2013/06/16/intellectually-fit-as-socially-misfit/
diana_coman: ie a problem more of inept and insecure bosses ultimately than of anything else
diana_coman: onth canadians/brits will indeed bother less about preserving the "prestige" of the boss but are bothered tremendously to the point of being severely restrained by the group-signalling
diana_coman: I suppose the similarity is in that *both* cases are bent on appearance rather than substance but the difference is simply that for one set the reference is boss-approval, while for the other the reference is the fashion/social-consensus.
shrysr: yea. i think lip service describes it a lot better than politically correct. The impression gathered from my dads stories is that there was a generation of people, who cared abt quality and competence... and spent a long time gathering it and propagating it atleast to ppl directly under them, sort of similar to the way guidance/apprenticeship is looked at here. I supppose many of these ppl are approaching
shrysr: senility now. this appears largely absent in todays bosses from what i have seen.... and i also think it is a major reason why i've been ... well.. roaming like a gypsy.
shrysr: UK and USA fwiw is actually among the 'hot spots' of CFD work. I was talking to one of my few friends from my time in Leeds, who has been posted in coventry for a bit... we were remarking that the CFD engg is treated as a ..well a reasonably prized possession there, whereas the attitude is quite opposite in india. Hez an electronics engg and older ~5 yrs and has been with the same automotive company since
shrysr: being recruited out of uni... and i've never been in the automotive industry. It was a re-confirmation of my view point of CFD i guess.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002660 - the part re past generation is quite likely actually; but it's more generally spread, not india-only, that's the bigger issue and part of the signs of decay.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 13:46:52 shrysr: yea. i think lip service describes it a lot better than politically correct. The impression gathered from my dads stories is that there was a generation of people, who cared abt quality and competence... and spent a long time gathering it and propagating it atleast to ppl directly under them, sort of similar to the way guidance/apprenticeship is looked at here. I supppose many of these ppl are approaching
lobbes: phew I ate #t logs, now to eat #o logs!
diana_coman: bon appetit!
shrysr: diana_coman: i presume i need to eat #t everyday? I've been focused on #o and not so regular on #t so far tbh.
jfw: diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002518 << I've been contemplating the offer, which certainly sounds like a great opportunity, and doing the looking around. My next few days are packed so I will get back to it on Wednesday. My main question for now, that I may better evaluate my fitness for it, is what does 'submit to training' entail? My sense so far is that it's a
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 09:08:16 diana_coman: have a look around, ask any questions you need to ask and if/when you decide you want to submit to training here, say so.
jfw: mix of advising on one's own goals, assigned reading/writing, and helping with your projects as the possibility arises.
jfw: Relatedly, is there to be a prescribed pace, beyond the minimums of say http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002668 ? Or is it more about setting one's own deadlines and honoring them (or some other standard entirely)?
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 15:18:57 shrysr: diana_coman: i presume i need to eat #t everyday? I've been focused on #o and not so regular on #t so far tbh.
diana_coman: shrysr: re #trilema - only to the extent that you actually have time; while it's always good to follow, you still have more pressing matters than following that; lobbes has been around and more involved for much more so for him it's less of a jump than it is for you.
diana_coman: just do for now first and foremost what you have on your plate and you'll get to #t soon too, don't worry about it just yet.
diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-15#1002669 - you should read the #ossasepia log as it's not that long and it'll answer your question best, eg this thread http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-07-30#999773
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 15:56:28 jfw: diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002518 << I've been contemplating the offer, which certainly sounds like a great opportunity, and doing the looking around. My next few days are packed so I will get back to it on Wednesday. My main question for now, that I may better evaluate my fitness for it, is what does 'submit to training' entail? My sense so far is that it's a
ossabot: Logged on 2019-07-30 11:02:00 diana_coman: ultimately yes, learning happens only if you submit to a teacher; is this news?
diana_coman: to make it perfectly clear: it's submitting to me as a mentor, not to some "prescribed pace" or programme or whatever; it's a relationship mentor-mentee and as such fully dependent on the people involved; for that matter, you may apply and I'll try to get to know you a bit better first before I can decide if I'll take you on or not.
diana_coman: this thread is relevant too: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002521
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 09:18:30 diana_coman: and since this will be a licensed castle too, there will be the proper rankings as well (pageboy as entry level, squire as middle level and knight at graduation)
diana_coman: jfw: understand though this: the goal is to bring *you* up to the best you can be and as such the tasks and exact working will inevitably depend on what you need; while there are topics and that all need to master and skills that all need to acquire, the exact path is *not* predefined and I fully intend to keep it that way.
diana_coman: and yes, you'll have to submit to my judgement and to commit for the long term too as it'll take some time (how much it all takes depends on you really).
diana_coman: jfw: to give a clearer example of "submit to me" - by "what you need" I fully mean what I see that you need; this might at times clash with what you think you need but while you are welcome to ask questions to improve your understanding of why you are asked to do that, you will still have to do it if I asked for it.
jfw: Alright. I will plan to read the full log, and look forward to finding out in due course if I am worthy of pageboyhood.
diana_coman: jfw: cool; feel free to ask any further questions you have.
diana_coman: jfw: btw a quite crucial bit is this http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-14#1002605
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-14 20:48:31 shrysr: thought - if found+fired - then so be it. if allowed - i might even venture to say - there is no point being here...and not .. well being honest / vulnerable - in order to become stronger, as I think you advised before.
lobbes: diana_coman: I had a thought: should my eventual 'penance' posts be on younghands.club do you think? Or should they be from my personal blog still?
shrysr: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/ossasepia/2019-09-11#1002064 << did you mean that as in 'sweet youth n innocence' = impossible? I believe what i've written.. but idk - it seems most others find such happiness through other means like marriage/kids? I've wonderd if it basically means that as a human, you are wired to find wholesome happiness caring for/ being with a companion... and that my view of wholesome
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-11 16:46:12 diana_coman: 6.1 is endearing
shrysr: happiness is incomplete. For eg w.r.t spending money - i've felt more happiness/pleasure getting stuff for others, and a happiness of ...relatively ephemeral and superficial nature while indulging in maself. However, i've also thought relationships/starting family fundamentally a time sink, potentially quick-sand.. done out of a fear of being lonely more than anything else.
shrysr: http://trilema.com/2013/the-stock-warrant-instrument-explained/#selection-73.231-73.271 << ima been re-reading several times - but still having trouble defining what a warrant is. Per selection - i understand that the warrants enable the fisherman to put money on table w/o being investor - but I'm thinking - by bringing money to the table - the fisherman *is* an investor even if you wanna call it warrant?
shrysr: or is a warrant more like... a loan, money that the fisherman does not have?
shrysr: but even if a loan - fisherman bringing any money at all to fuel venture makes him investor?
shrysr: http://trilema.com/2013/the-stock-warrant-instrument-explained/#selection-43.685-43.721 << for eg : if investor already put in 100 btc for tools... then why does fisherman have to bring in anything? he cd just take boat+tools and get fish, return with 200btc of fish? fisherman borrows 100 btc is shown ---> does
shrysr: this mean that the fisherman put in 100btc investment - in order to be able to catch 200 btc worth of fish, which was not possible with the 100 btc investment?
shrysr: also is the correct notation btc or BTC?
lobbes: I've seen both used fwiw. most will be able to parse
shrysr: hmm the article itself had both btc and BTC... was confused a sec, but the addition/explanation does appear to indicate both notations are acceptable.
shrysr: re: SSW piece, footnote (ii) makes it almost clear actually.. i think. Warrants are negotiated by fisherman with investor/money-lender (?) ..can it be said that warrants are a way to 'stake a claim' in the total return from the whole venture, based on risk to the participant? hmm so if fisherman got instead 200 btc of warrants to investors 100 btc - the total value of venture 400 btc (200 btc (fish) + 200
shrysr: (warrants)) would be divided now among 300 shares (100 investor + 200 fisherman warrants), with 1/3rd going to investor and 2/3rds going to fisherman. but it doesnt seem to only be 'staking a claim', because the warrants are also being added to the total value of the venture, in addition to increasing shares (of the fisherman). why are warrants being added to the total value of the venture, whereas
shrysr: investor's 100 btc are considered only for shares?
shrysr: so warrant in total : stake of claim on total value (results) based on risk + represent the value addition of the participant to the whole... activity/deal?

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