#ossasepia Logs for 07 Oct 2019

April 20th, 2020
diana_coman: rekt_: привет! are you in Russia? [03:15]
rekt_: No, that is one of my languages [03:15]
rekt_: Russian ftw [03:16]
diana_coman: rekt_: what other languages do you speak then? [03:17]
diana_coman: thimbronion: ah, your blog is with pizarro too, sigh; I'll look at the paste later today [03:18]
diana_coman: thimbronion: at a quick look: 1. you really need to practice saying things *in your own words*; 2. when you go "how is x different from y" the answer should take the shape of "x is this way while y is that way" for various "way" [03:21]
diana_coman: thimbronion: lolz, you have two 1; re first paragraph of your summary - you don't merely replace the mushroom metaphor, you outright change the subject there! your first paragraph betrays a "wtf, I have no idea what this is" re the first original paragraph [03:23]
diana_coman: thimbronion: and instead of struggling to figure out what the author actually says there, you trim and chop it to fit your pre-existing thoughts [03:23]
diana_coman: thimbronion: as I said it before to shrysr , so it applies to you: http://ossasepia.com/2020/04/20/ossasepia-logs-for-27-Sep-2019#1004132 [03:25]
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-27 15:51:51 diana_coman: shrysr: when you read something it should be a lot more the *other* way around - you may look at how you fit the description there (even how you change to fit the description there) and certainly NOT "how to change the description to fit me" [03:25]
diana_coman: rekt_: don't be shy; the more you engage and interact, the better for you really; and who knows what comes out of it. [03:27]
diana_coman: thimbronion: a review (as well as quite a few other things actually, god dammit it) has a structure too, you know? you don't just plonk "this is dog" and then put there whatever went on in your mind. [10:52]
diana_coman: *before* you are allowed to publish words you should *know what the fuck you want to say* [10:53]
diana_coman: sure, you can write 1mn drafts and work your way in writing to understanding [10:53]
diana_coman: but they are not going to be called summaries for that, no matter how many times you introduce them as such [10:54]
diana_coman: thimbronion: you know, if you *have to say* "this is a summary/review/dog", chances are very, very high that it's precisely because it is...not yet a summary/review/dog [10:55]
diana_coman: you should get some slop for dinner, served with a very nice label "this is cordon bleu"; see what that does for you. [10:58]
diana_coman: thimbronion: there are several ways you can structure your review, sure; but structure it you must; if it's just "something that grew", it's the above slop. [11:01]
diana_coman: thimbronion: do the simplest of structures: start with the goal (you're reviewing your own summary as an exercise and as a needed step to be able to improve on next attempt) overall conclusion (it sucks on aspect A, B, C; there is perhaps D that sort of works but fails short on E etc) and then take each of those aspects and detail them [11:05]
diana_coman: at the end, you can add then the discussion as to why each fail, sure; it's basically part of fulfilling that original goal of the exercise. [11:07]
diana_coman: but note that a review in itself is *not concerned* with whatever excuses; it's concerned with evaluating the thing reviewed, as it stands, that's all. [11:10]
diana_coman: thimbronion: on the irc task: what's your current plan re talking to them? [11:14]
rekt_: Hi. Sorry, a little busy [11:51]
thimbronion: diana_coman: My plan is to start at the top of the list, find out who is in charge of administering the network and state the facts, document response. I would prefer to wait until my blog is back up so I can have mp's and your comments more freshly in mind before going in. If my blog is not back by tonight I will go in tomorrow without it. [11:53]
thimbronion: http://ossasepia.com/2020/04/20/ossasepia-logs-for-07-Oct-2019#1004751 << I will rewrite review by EOD Sunday. [12:03]
ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-07 11:05:12 diana_coman: thimbronion: do the simplest of structures: start with the goal (you're reviewing your own summary as an exercise and as a needed step to be able to improve on next attempt) overall conclusion (it sucks on aspect A, B, C; there is perhaps D that sort of works but fails short on E etc) and then take each of those aspects and detail them [12:03]
diana_coman: thimbronion: all right; mind you state the goal in your *own words* + ask if stuck/lost again, yes? [12:04]
thimbronion: diana_coman: How do I know some words are my own? [12:05]
diana_coman: thimbronion: practice; try restating that goal-statement in at least 3 ways. [12:05]
diana_coman: thimbronion: some words are your own if you a. know exactly what they mean b. know exactly why you chose to use *each of them* to say whatever you are saying [12:06]
diana_coman: it's not enough to say "I agree with X's statement" [12:06]
diana_coman: that is at best a sort of passive understanding of a thing and it's *not enough* [12:06]
diana_coman: thimbronion: say something [12:16]
thimbronion: diana_coman: I know I have questions but I don't think they'll be clear to me until I try the restatement exercise. [12:17]
diana_coman: thimbronion: all right; how about http://ossasepia.com/2020/04/20/ossasepia-logs-for-07-Oct-2019#1004754 ? [12:19]
ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-07 11:14:23 diana_coman: thimbronion: on the irc task: what's your current plan re talking to them? [12:19]
thimbronion: diana_coman: http://ossasepia.com/2020/04/20/ossasepia-logs-for-07-Oct-2019#1004756 [12:19]
ossabot: Logged on 2019-10-07 11:53:37 thimbronion: diana_coman: My plan is to start at the top of the list, find out who is in charge of administering the network and state the facts, document response. I would prefer to wait until my blog is back up so I can have mp's and your comments more freshly in mind before going in. If my blog is not back by tonight I will go in tomorrow without it. [12:19]
diana_coman: thimbronion: re your blog yes, ugh; we will have to wait and sort it out first indeed, for several reasons; re plan though: you just need to go to their admin chan or whatever and *ask* who is in charge + talk, that's all. [12:21]
thimbronion: diana_coman: can you expand more on talk? [12:22]
diana_coman: thimbronion: what's the unclear part there? you know, like every time you go to a new place, you say hello and where you're coming from + why you are there + asking who should you be talking to if not there/them; let them answer, answer the challenges etc [12:25]
diana_coman: re coming from - TMSR in this case, hopefully that much is clear [12:25]
thimbronion: diana_coman: I wasn't clear on the difference between "stating the facts" and talking. [12:27]
diana_coman: thimbronion: talking involves actually interacting with the other party ie reacting as well as stating the facts [12:27]
diana_coman: several steps. [12:28]
thimbronion: diana_coman: Is there a particular link that would be best in this context for giving to administrators who are curious about TMSR? [12:28]
diana_coman: thimbronion: in this particular context I'd give them the logger really with direct statement that look, we have several very active and lively chans + infrastructure and all [12:29]
diana_coman: and invite them to join to find out more, sure, why not [12:29]
diana_coman: come and talk to us directly, why not [12:29]
thimbronion: diana_coman: hm yes, this makes much sense. [12:29]
diana_coman: you can ofc give basic explanations, there's the main forum #trilema and then various castles covering different aspects, it's growing etc [12:30]
thimbronion: diana_coman: in that case I would definitely like to wait until we figure out what is going on in uy. Definitely don't want to send them to a dead link. [12:31]
diana_coman: but realise that you are giving them the crumbs to follow and that because you are kind hearted pretty much; you are specifically *not* explaining yourself to them because they have no such claim over you, nor can they have it [12:31]
diana_coman: thimbronion: well, you can always send them to my logger that is fine and well ofc; but anyways, yes, I'd wait a bit for now to get out of the pizmess first, one way or another [12:32]
diana_coman: rekt_: up to you really but note that 1. no opportunity lasts forever 2. busy may be at one time or another, but can't quite last for days on end (or you have a very serious problem with your own time management there) [12:35]
thimbronion: diana_coman: concerning China, I'm going to ask for some research this week, the result being a list of mainland China based Bitcoin focused blogs with specific, named authors. [12:35]
rekt_: I have a very rigid daily program [12:36]
diana_coman: thimbronion: for that matter why not ask re irc/equivalent networks/chans; I have no idea exactly what they have in there [12:36]
rekt_: breakfast, gym, food, study 20 languages, food, work, gym, food, sleep [12:36]
diana_coman: rekt_: and so if/when opportunity knocks on your door you say "I have no time because I have a very rigid program" ? [12:37]
diana_coman: rekt_: *some* slack time has to be part of the most rigid program too; for that matter you are still human, not a robot [12:37]
thimbronion: diana_coman: the thought occurred to look for China based IRC networks. I will inquire there as well. This may require some education on the part of my contact. [12:38]
diana_coman: I mean: it sounds like a very strong will and all that, hopefully it also works well for you; but still. [12:39]
diana_coman: rekt_: ^ is for you. [12:39]
rekt_: Yes I don't have time for a relationship [12:39]
rekt_: Been single for 20 heads [12:39]
rekt_: 20 years * [12:39]
diana_coman: rekt_: uhm, if that's your worry, put it to rest, lolz. [12:39]
rekt_: My life is about long term plan [12:40]
rekt_: if what is my worry? [12:40]
rekt_: How weak is a person who complains about the fact [12:40]
rekt_: Vs a person who sees it as a fact and remains like I am, unaffected? [12:40]
diana_coman: rekt_: if your worry here is geting into a relationship ie time-eating [12:40]
diana_coman: rekt_: neah, you got the wrong end of the stick there, simmer down. [12:41]
rekt_: Read my last message [12:41]
rekt_: Maybe you're confused about my personal strength [12:41]
diana_coman: rekt_: no, I have no idea about your personal strength; but you are talking to your own strawmen there, not to what I said. [12:41]
rekt_: I addressed my capacity for facing reality, but you insist I am worried [12:42]
rekt_: Not sure what I'd be worried about [12:42]
diana_coman: rekt_: not at all, no [12:42]
rekt_: My only concern is my long term goal [12:42]
rekt_: Peace out triggered snowflake trumpets [12:43]
diana_coman: lolz. [12:44]
diana_coman: can't argue with a man on a very rigid plan, what. [12:44]
diana_coman: studying 20 languages but being utterly unable to communicate; takes the whole modern autism to another level. [12:54]
bvt: tbh that sounded a lot like cat-v to me [12:58]
diana_coman: bvt: how/why's that? [12:59]
bvt: he insisted on this 'life = long-term plans', but was not really communicating with anyone [13:01]
bvt: i immediately rememebered one case of mp entering some cat-v-derived channel, with their insistence on 'authority = send us patches', but also not communicating, just repeating the mantra [13:03]
diana_coman: bvt: in principle single-minded focus to the extreme; he was *very* triggered by some impression that "not strong" though [13:03]
diana_coman: ah, but that "just repeating the mantra" is precisely the "modern day autism" I mentioned; you'll meet it already if you just say something "out of script" to whatever employee [13:04]
diana_coman: the multiple lulz here is that he claimed he focused on studying languages of all things; but other than that it's very common really; this "word x -> reply y", no meaning involved, no person really, just an automaton repeating - as you say - mantras [13:05]
bvt: well, getting easily triggered seems to be highly individual, but extreme singular focus is what distiguishes cat-v for me [13:06]
diana_coman: fwiw I fished him out of some oftc sad&deserted chan that wasn't however cat-v; can't even recall exactly which one, I did a foray in thimbronion's selection of networks the other day [13:07]
bvt: looks like one of the manalone 'evolution' direction, should be plenty in all fields (languages or saving unix); and i also wonder, he did not even say what he needs 20 languages for? [13:10]
diana_coman: bvt: iirc he said something (possibly before coming here) re travelling the world and making money out of vlogging [13:10]
diana_coman: and sure, in all fields; but learning languages while avoiding communication is so ...divorced of reality that I don't yet have full words for it really. [13:12]
thimbronion: diana_coman: Is there further instruction on how to proceed with plans/reviews? [23:14]